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Post by thetulsawarrior on Dec 11, 2022 13:39:19 GMT -6
The GB staff has done an outstanding job on social media and deserves a solid grade of "A plus"--based on content and overall effort across multiple platforms. In the past I've been critical but believe we should be as quick to praise when due as we are to criticize.
The current athletic department and coaching staff have had to overcome a long list of obstacle not of their making -- some caused by past guardians of the program as well as external factors like the pandemic that hit some teams more than others. (How would you like to try attempting a total rebuild during a historic global health crisis)
There's hope for fans when they see effort and fight on and off the court. The hard work is appreciated.
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Post by phoenixbooster on Dec 17, 2022 19:55:55 GMT -6
While their social media presence may have improved to their minuscule and niche die-hard fan base, their overall marketing is almost non-existent. Most people have no idea about the home game schedule or location, or about the team, coach, or players. (A weekday non-holiday 11am tip-off?)! The in-game “entertainment” is old and uninspired, and instead of fun halftime acts like the Bud Light Daredevils, we have another Bud Light discount night. Having a Coach’s Show on a YouTube channel doesn’t cut it. To my knowledge, there are no partnerships with the local tv broadcast stations which could help promote the team and their games. As a former season ticket holder (from the Bennett years until 3 years ago), I haven’t received a phone call or mailing - asking for a renewal, or even a donation. The reason I bring this up is not to complain, but rather to explain how much this D1 program is in complete disarray. This problem begins at the top and can be fixed with a major effort and finding the right people on the real marketing side. Winning will help cure some of this, but with so many options for entertainment events and dollars, there needs to be an aggressive, consistent, and continuous marketing plan. Ok, just my two cents worth!
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Post by thetulsawarrior on Dec 17, 2022 22:56:06 GMT -6
Yep, marketing isn't just putting videos on social media. I'm half way across the country so I just see part of the picture. Getting thousands of kids to the arena was a creative effort. A YouTube coaches show doesn't bother me, that's where the market is going. You're right that someone needs to get back in contact with fans like you.
Winning cures a lot, but with the changing college scene and the $ hole built by two former ADs, your rebuild starts below ground zero. The schedule has been a killer for both the players and coaches. The team is tired and whoever put the schedule together needs to understand that has been counterproductive for everyone who cares about the program. Southern Indiana, Washington D.C., up and down the Midwest and along the west coast -- all that from November 7th to December 18th.
My marketing and team building experience tells me it can be done again in Green Bay. There needs to be a full court press and people willing to lend a hand, listen, think outside the box and do it all within the available resources.
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Dec 18, 2022 9:03:34 GMT -6
I agree with booster, they don't do a great job of marketing to people that are outside of those who are already interested.
In defense of the athletic department doing many of the things needed to enhance this effort requires people and money that don't exist.
This season hasn't helped but the GB brand has been less relevant in the past years leading up to now than ever before. TV stations and the newspaper don't cover the team much. They are looking for ways to do less not more.
With less community interest there is less money. With less money there is less ability to fix the marketing. It is a hamster wheel that is hard to get off of.
Now nobody calling about ticket renewals is an issue they seem to have people for and should be able to fix.
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Post by uscg2012 on Dec 18, 2022 9:56:39 GMT -6
I agree with booster, they don't do a great job of marketing to people that are outside of those who are already interested. In defense of the athletic department doing many of the things needed to enhance this effort requires people and money that don't exist. This season hasn't helped but the GB brand has been less relevant in the past years leading up to now than ever before. TV stations and the newspaper don't cover the team much. They are looking for ways to do less not more. With less community interest there is less money. With less money there is less ability to fix the marketing. It is a hamster wheel that is hard to get off of. Now nobody calling about ticket renewals is an issue they seem to have people for and should be able to fix. Having a winning basketball team solves a lot of these issues….
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Dec 18, 2022 11:08:46 GMT -6
I agree with booster, they don't do a great job of marketing to people that are outside of those who are already interested. In defense of the athletic department doing many of the things needed to enhance this effort requires people and money that don't exist. This season hasn't helped but the GB brand has been less relevant in the past years leading up to now than ever before. TV stations and the newspaper don't cover the team much. They are looking for ways to do less not more. With less community interest there is less money. With less money there is less ability to fix the marketing. It is a hamster wheel that is hard to get off of. Now nobody calling about ticket renewals is an issue they seem to have people for and should be able to fix. Having a winning basketball team solves a lot of these issues…. Marketing is about exposing your product to consumers wether you have the best product or not. It is about creating an experience, a brand loyalty or showing how to solve a problem. Winning basketball games only fixes this until you aren't winning basketball games again. So yes more people would come if they were winning and then those people will drop off when they aren't. The university itself used to spend $0 on marketing. Now they spend 7 figures. Look at what happened, the university grew before the actual university became stronger. If they stopped spending that money now the university would likely stop growing. With how cheap tickets are and how much of the ticket goes to fees, returning to the pre Darner crowds maybe generates a low six figure amount of money. That isn't insignificant and yet it isn't even close to getting the team on the financial footing they need to be to have sustained success. To put it in perspective it would take $150,000 to get the head coaches salary to the point that they could hire a guy everyone would agree on. That same amount of money doesn't even take two buy games off the schedule. I've said it before and I will say it again. The university runs this program like a low major. Until that changes it is going to be harder to win than people think it should be.
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Post by kmell822 on Dec 19, 2022 15:51:34 GMT -6
I agree with booster, they don't do a great job of marketing to people that are outside of those who are already interested. In defense of the athletic department doing many of the things needed to enhance this effort requires people and money that don't exist. This season hasn't helped but the GB brand has been less relevant in the past years leading up to now than ever before. TV stations and the newspaper don't cover the team much. They are looking for ways to do less not more. With less community interest there is less money. With less money there is less ability to fix the marketing. It is a hamster wheel that is hard to get off of. Now nobody calling about ticket renewals is an issue they seem to have people for and should be able to fix. Having a winning basketball team solves a lot of these issues…. Exactly!
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Post by thetulsawarrior on Dec 19, 2022 20:48:41 GMT -6
GB is a unique situation and the legacy issues of two former ADs created even more of a challenge. (Bad fit hires and contracts that never should have been proposed, let alone approved) Throw in the pandemic and I view this as year one of a rebuild.
Having been paid to cover several college programs over the years, I can tell you this is a tougher rebuild than Dick Bennett faced. FYI, it took Bennett five years to get the Nix to the NIT and he is a Hall of Fame coach. On top of that it was an entirely different era for college basketball. Good things can happen at GB. Box scores and social media posts don't give you the full picture.
If you're serious about understand where the program is, take a seat in the arena. There is a world of difference that way in understanding any situation.
The new AD seems like he can find additional resources. What I saw in person today was some good coaching decisions based on the hand he had to play and some athletes that didn’t give up. I'd look to the Oregon State and Wisconsin games to show you that this program can become competitive on a consistent basis. The in-state recruiting is something the old regime couldn't get started and Ryan and Company’s efforts on that front are encouraging.
If anyone asked my advise for the program I would suggest getting an old hand to help. Woody Wilson was a secret weapon/resource as an assistant to Bennett. The final suggestion would be to cutback on the money games with larger schools. They pay the bills but at what price? Find a balance.
As to advice for the community – embrace those who are trying to build, not those who live in negative thoughts. Anything else is self-fulfilling and destructive. What did Vince Lombardi say? “The greatest accomplishment is not in never falling, but in rising again after you fall.” Lend a hand to build something special.
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gbguy
Sophomore
Posts: 154
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Post by gbguy on Jan 1, 2023 8:30:00 GMT -6
Having a winning basketball team solves a lot of these issues…. Marketing is about exposing your product to consumers wether you have the best product or not. It is about creating an experience, a brand loyalty or showing how to solve a problem. Winning basketball games only fixes this until you aren't winning basketball games again. So yes more people would come if they were winning and then those people will drop off when they aren't. The university itself used to spend $0 on marketing. Now they spend 7 figures. Look at what happened, the university grew before the actual university became stronger. If they stopped spending that money now the university would likely stop growing. With how cheap tickets are and how much of the ticket goes to fees, returning to the pre Darner crowds maybe generates a low six figure amount of money. That isn't insignificant and yet it isn't even close to getting the team on the financial footing they need to be to have sustained success. To put it in perspective it would take $150,000 to get the head coaches salary to the point that they could hire a guy everyone would agree on. That same amount of money doesn't even take two buy games off the schedule. I've said it before and I will say it again. The university runs this program like a low major. Until that changes it is going to be harder to win than people think it should be. Because it IS a low major program! Hiring the guy who is the son of a legend at UW-Madison, who you would not have remotely considered hiring otherwise, is what low major programs do. I think they THOUGHT this was marketing the program. At least when they hired Darner, they TRIED something different. This hire was hoping against hope that genetics and name recognition would work, and its been a disaster. Anyway the UW schools outside of Madison don't have a lot of money. There is a reason Milwaukee and Green Bay get passed over repeatedly when other conferences come and cherry-pick Horizon League members for expansion. It's much closer to a UW-Oshkosh product than a UW-Madison product. I am a long-time lurker, Green Bay resident, who has watched this program for a long time. I can honestly say that it has never been more of an afterthought by the local media and community at large. But I really don't know what they can do outside of addressing the coach situation and win more. They could throw the doors open and give out free beer and the Resch wouldn't make it to half full right now. Sorry for the hell of a first post but this has been such a frustration for me.
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Post by cuchillo on Jan 1, 2023 8:39:50 GMT -6
Marketing is about exposing your product to consumers wether you have the best product or not. It is about creating an experience, a brand loyalty or showing how to solve a problem. Winning basketball games only fixes this until you aren't winning basketball games again. So yes more people would come if they were winning and then those people will drop off when they aren't. The university itself used to spend $0 on marketing. Now they spend 7 figures. Look at what happened, the university grew before the actual university became stronger. If they stopped spending that money now the university would likely stop growing. With how cheap tickets are and how much of the ticket goes to fees, returning to the pre Darner crowds maybe generates a low six figure amount of money. That isn't insignificant and yet it isn't even close to getting the team on the financial footing they need to be to have sustained success. To put it in perspective it would take $150,000 to get the head coaches salary to the point that they could hire a guy everyone would agree on. That same amount of money doesn't even take two buy games off the schedule. I've said it before and I will say it again. The university runs this program like a low major. Until that changes it is going to be harder to win than people think it should be. Because it IS a low major program! Hiring the guy who is the son of a legend at UW-Madison, who you would not have remotely considered hiring otherwise, is what low major programs do. I think they THOUGHT this was marketing the program. At least when they hired Darner, they TRIED something different. This hire was hoping against hope that genetics and name recognition would work, and its been a disaster. Anyway the UW schools outside of Madison don't have a lot of money. There is a reason Milwaukee and Green Bay get passed over repeatedly when other conferences come and cherry-pick Horizon League members for expansion. It's much closer to a UW-Oshkosh product than a UW-Madison product. I am a long-time lurker, Green Bay resident, who has watched this program for a long time. I can honestly say that it has never been more of an afterthought by the local media and community at large. But I really don't know what they can do outside of addressing the coach situation and win more. They could throw the doors open and give out free beer and the Resch wouldn't make it to half full right now. Sorry for the hell of a first post but this has been such a frustration for me. Your post is spot-on. This buttresses my argument that the fault lies with poor administrative decisions and a couple truly horrendous AD hires (as bad as Guthrie was Gillespie was 100 times worse). There is ZERO vision from recent leadership and nothing that approaches what Ed Weidner and Don Harden had.
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gbguy
Sophomore
Posts: 154
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Post by gbguy on Jan 1, 2023 9:26:57 GMT -6
Because it IS a low major program! Hiring the guy who is the son of a legend at UW-Madison, who you would not have remotely considered hiring otherwise, is what low major programs do. I think they THOUGHT this was marketing the program. At least when they hired Darner, they TRIED something different. This hire was hoping against hope that genetics and name recognition would work, and its been a disaster. Anyway the UW schools outside of Madison don't have a lot of money. There is a reason Milwaukee and Green Bay get passed over repeatedly when other conferences come and cherry-pick Horizon League members for expansion. It's much closer to a UW-Oshkosh product than a UW-Madison product. I am a long-time lurker, Green Bay resident, who has watched this program for a long time. I can honestly say that it has never been more of an afterthought by the local media and community at large. But I really don't know what they can do outside of addressing the coach situation and win more. They could throw the doors open and give out free beer and the Resch wouldn't make it to half full right now. Sorry for the hell of a first post but this has been such a frustration for me. Your post is spot-on. This buttresses my argument that the fault lies with poor administrative decisions and a couple truly horrendous AD hires (as bad as Guthrie was Gillespie was 100 times worse). There is ZERO vision from recent leadership and nothing that approaches what Ed Weidner and Don Harden had. When you have a mediocre AD like Guthrie nearly doubling his salary going to a place like Akron, that should tell you something about the state of athletics at UWGB. I have no opinion whatsoever on Josh Moon because I think his hands are completely tied. He is stuck with a coach he didn't hire (and maybe his boss likes him. I don't know.) Even if he wanted to make a move, I doubt the University can afford it.
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Post by cuchillo on Jan 1, 2023 10:54:16 GMT -6
Your post is spot-on. This buttresses my argument that the fault lies with poor administrative decisions and a couple truly horrendous AD hires (as bad as Guthrie was Gillespie was 100 times worse). There is ZERO vision from recent leadership and nothing that approaches what Ed Weidner and Don Harden had. When you have a mediocre AD like Guthrie nearly doubling his salary going to a place like Akron, that should tell you something about the state of athletics at UWGB. I have no opinion whatsoever on Josh Moon because I think his hands are completely tied. He is stuck with a coach he didn't hire (and maybe his boss likes him. I don't know.) Even if he wanted to make a move, I doubt the University can afford it. The jury is definitely still out on Moon. Guthrie was terrible and the fact he got hired at Akron tells you poor leadership in academia is not exclusive to UWGB. Gillespie isn't even worth wasting the keystrokes on.
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