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Post by doublej on Oct 25, 2022 19:19:00 GMT -6
Nothing like the pack line defense to give you the jitters....ha There’s also just nothing happening on the offensive front, regardless of the Green Knight defense. No flow, no order to anything the Nix do, they’re just standing around and trying to out-athlete SNC, which isn’t working. Grzesk is simply out coaching Will Ryan, which I expected would be the case. Will isn’t the coach for this team and I’ve been saying this since he was hired. Not enough post touches & too many perimeter passes so far
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Post by jzenk42 on Oct 25, 2022 20:01:55 GMT -6
Man, I think if GB got random fans from the stands, they would have shot better from 3 and the FT line
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Post by barnzoboy on Oct 26, 2022 5:29:05 GMT -6
I appreciate the comments, although certainly not encouraging from what I read here. Can anyone post a final score, I mean, did we (UWGB) win? I don't suppose a box score will be anywhere to be found?
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Post by barnzoboy on Oct 26, 2022 5:31:29 GMT -6
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Oct 26, 2022 8:11:04 GMT -6
The comment about free throws is accurate and a big difference in the game. GB missed at least 10. The guys who were missing were guys that I would normally think would make most of them. Zeigler, Davis and Rose all missed.
The other thing that stood out to me in a not so good way was open court decision making. GB's turnovers were mostly dead ball. On the flip side SNC had several live ball turnovers. Unfortunately, GB didn't convert on several of them. Some were related to rust and others were just overly aggressive. I am pretty sure with 40ish seconds left and with a 3 or 4 point lead GB threw a pass ahead the length of the floor that didn't connect. That was a good synopsis of the open court play for much of the game.
SNC packed in the paint and that was a problem for a ball screen heavy offense. The play makers turned the corner and had nowhere to go. It also impacted the ability to feed the post. Fortunately for GB a lot of Horizon League teams play fast or want to play fast. Packing the lane is not conducive to playing fast. A lot of the GB back cuts or ball screen action should work better against extended defenses.
Speaking of defense and this has not really been discussed that heavily to this point. The SNC offense generated some scores early in the game as some of the new players for GB had to adjust to how to defend as well as when and where to help from. Once that happened GB's defense was all over the place and never really let up. Guys like Cummings, Zeigler, Blake and Heffner in particular were making defensive effort plays. The offense wasn't clicking but the defense didn't wilt. The supposedly better coach didn't have an answer for GB's defense for the last 30 minutes of the game.
Overall this was not an instant classic for GB and they let an inferior team keep a game close even. I am keeping in mind these games are more about gaining experience and getting film so guys can improve for the regular season. GB isn't going 11 deep in the first half at ISU on November 7th. I would be surprised if the team doesn't look better next Thursday and better again for the season opener.
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Post by gbtruther on Oct 26, 2022 8:12:51 GMT -6
I'm back........ its a sad day this morning. Does not appear the team has improved offensively. I know its just an exhibition but how does this team only score 50 on SNC? Size and athleticism alone should cover that. It's early so hopefully things can turn around. Also, why isn't a boxscore posted? The results are the results, put them on the website.
If anyone has a good breakdown of the game they can provide, it would be much appreciated.
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Post by cuchillo on Oct 26, 2022 8:19:43 GMT -6
The comment about free throws is accurate and a big difference in the game. GB missed at least 10. The guys who were missing were guys that I would normally think would make most of them. Zeigler, Davis and Rose all missed. The other thing that stood out to me in a not so good way was open court decision making. GB's turnovers were mostly dead ball. On the flip side SNC had several live ball turnovers. Unfortunately, GB didn't convert on several of them. Some were related to rust and others were just overly aggressive. I am pretty sure with 40ish seconds left and with a 3 or 4 point lead GB threw a pass ahead the length of the floor that didn't connect. That was a good synopsis of the open court play for much of the game. SNC packed in the paint and that was a problem for a ball screen heavy offense. The play makers turned the corner and had nowhere to go. It also impacted the ability to feed the post. Fortunately for GB a lot of Horizon League teams play fast or want to play fast. Packing the lane is not conducive to playing fast. A lot of the GB back cuts or ball screen action should work better against extended defenses. Speaking of defense and this has not really been discussed that heavily to this point. The SNC offense generated some scores early in the game as some of the new players for GB had to adjust to how to defend as well as when and where to help from. Once that happened GB's defense was all over the place and never really let up. Guys like Cummings, Zeigler, Blake and Heffner in particular were making defensive effort plays. The offense wasn't clicking but the defense didn't wilt. The supposedly better coach didn't have an answer for GB's defense for the last 30 minutes of the game. Overall this was not an instant classic for GB and they let an inferior team keep a game close even. I am keeping in mind these games are more about gaining experience and getting film so guys can improve for the regular season. GB isn't going 11 deep in the first half at ISU on November 7th. I would be surprised if the team doesn't look better next Thursday and better again for the season opener. I'm curious, if the two coaches trade rosters last night, what do you think the score of the game is? St. Norbert had a lot of good looks rim out last night. Less athletic players also got tentative around the rim against more athletic players. Here is the story from The Press Times. Was the Press-Gazette there? gopresstimes.com/2022/10/25/green-bay-outlasts-snc-in-second-half/
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Post by thetulsawarrior on Oct 26, 2022 8:23:29 GMT -6
And what is the purpose of an exhibition game? This was a perfect classroom for a team with so many newcomers. Playing against a Dick Bennett style team, even if they are a D3 squad, is the closet thing to going to the dentist and not getting a shot of Novocain when being worked on. At this point in the pre-season you want a humility bath for the players. The Nix got that along with a flood of teachable moments. The beginning of the season against so many high major programs will be difficult and probably ugly.
The test this fan is looking at is the growth curve and can the lessons being learned pay off in Horizon League action?
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Oct 26, 2022 8:39:56 GMT -6
The comment about free throws is accurate and a big difference in the game. GB missed at least 10. The guys who were missing were guys that I would normally think would make most of them. Zeigler, Davis and Rose all missed. The other thing that stood out to me in a not so good way was open court decision making. GB's turnovers were mostly dead ball. On the flip side SNC had several live ball turnovers. Unfortunately, GB didn't convert on several of them. Some were related to rust and others were just overly aggressive. I am pretty sure with 40ish seconds left and with a 3 or 4 point lead GB threw a pass ahead the length of the floor that didn't connect. That was a good synopsis of the open court play for much of the game. SNC packed in the paint and that was a problem for a ball screen heavy offense. The play makers turned the corner and had nowhere to go. It also impacted the ability to feed the post. Fortunately for GB a lot of Horizon League teams play fast or want to play fast. Packing the lane is not conducive to playing fast. A lot of the GB back cuts or ball screen action should work better against extended defenses. Speaking of defense and this has not really been discussed that heavily to this point. The SNC offense generated some scores early in the game as some of the new players for GB had to adjust to how to defend as well as when and where to help from. Once that happened GB's defense was all over the place and never really let up. Guys like Cummings, Zeigler, Blake and Heffner in particular were making defensive effort plays. The offense wasn't clicking but the defense didn't wilt. The supposedly better coach didn't have an answer for GB's defense for the last 30 minutes of the game. Overall this was not an instant classic for GB and they let an inferior team keep a game close even. I am keeping in mind these games are more about gaining experience and getting film so guys can improve for the regular season. GB isn't going 11 deep in the first half at ISU on November 7th. I would be surprised if the team doesn't look better next Thursday and better again for the season opener. I'm curious, if the two coaches trade rosters last night, what do you think the score of the game is? St. Norbert had a lot of good looks rim out last night. Less athletic players also got tentative around the rim against more athletic players. Here is the story from The Press Times. Was the Press-Gazette there? gopresstimes.com/2022/10/25/green-bay-outlasts-snc-in-second-half/SNC had 11 points in four minutes. They had 34 points in the remaining 36 minutes. What adjustment did Gary make? None. Forget about rosters, what did the better coach do to win the game? Nothing, he stayed with his system. Would Zeigler, Davis, Cummings and Rose not have their wide open 3's rim out because Gary is in the sideline. Would the free throws suddenly go down because Gary is at the north end of the Resch instead of the south? GB has a new offensive system and they stayed with it. It's okay for Gary to stick to his plan but not Will. Got it.
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Post by cuchillo on Oct 26, 2022 9:09:13 GMT -6
I'm curious, if the two coaches trade rosters last night, what do you think the score of the game is? St. Norbert had a lot of good looks rim out last night. Less athletic players also got tentative around the rim against more athletic players. Here is the story from The Press Times. Was the Press-Gazette there? gopresstimes.com/2022/10/25/green-bay-outlasts-snc-in-second-half/SNC had 11 points in four minutes. They had 34 points in the remaining 36 minutes. What adjustment did Gary make? None. Forget about rosters, what did the better coach do to win the game? Nothing, he stayed with his system. Would Zeigler, Davis, Cummings and Rose not have their wide open 3's rim out because Gary is in the sideline. Would the free throws suddenly go down because Gary is at the north end of the Resch instead of the south? GB has a new offensive system and they stayed with it. It's okay for Gary to stick to his plan but not Will. Got it. You still didn't answer the initial question. St. Norbert has also been practicing for virtually a week. How long as GB been practicing? I say that as someone who thought Will was a good hire. If a mid-level D3 team shoots 28 percent against you and you still only win by five, that's not a good sign. If SNC can get 63 shots up how many will teams superior to GB get and make? As someone who was going to UWGB games already in the early 90s, it's sad to see the current state of the union.
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Oct 26, 2022 9:46:30 GMT -6
If Gary was the coach for GB he would use the same system he uses for SNC. He uses a system that doesn't need more athletic players and wouldn't maximize more athletic players anyway. To answer the question I highly doubt GB wins by a lot more in this hypothetical question. For GB guys were wide open and had shots rim out, they got to the free throw line and missed free throws and they had guys fumble away easy transition baskets. Those items aren't changing because the almighty Gary G would be coaching GB.
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Post by yayphoenixyay on Oct 26, 2022 9:49:54 GMT -6
SNC had 11 points in four minutes. They had 34 points in the remaining 36 minutes. What adjustment did Gary make? None. Forget about rosters, what did the better coach do to win the game? Nothing, he stayed with his system. Would Zeigler, Davis, Cummings and Rose not have their wide open 3's rim out because Gary is in the sideline. Would the free throws suddenly go down because Gary is at the north end of the Resch instead of the south? GB has a new offensive system and they stayed with it. It's okay for Gary to stick to his plan but not Will. Got it. You still didn't answer the initial question. St. Norbert has also been practicing for virtually a week. How long as GB been practicing? I say that as someone who thought Will was a good hire. If a mid-level D3 team shoots 28 percent against you and you still only win by five, that's not a good sign. If SNC can get 63 shots up how many will teams superior to GB get and make? As someone who was going to UWGB games already in the early 90s, it's sad to see the current state of the union. The greater point being that, talent-wise, the Nix should have been superior, but they weren't. The fact that SNC almost won is a testament to their coaching, even if they couldn't generate points in the final minutes. Grzesk coaching the Nix would've made this a blowout, I can say that with confidence. Keep in mind, I do not like Grzesk as a person, at all. I'm good friends with many of his former players, and it is hard to find a good word about him, but he is undeniably a solid coach. Also important to note that SNC was playing without arguably their second best player, Parker Lawrence, as he is on the football team and they are still in midseason. Honestly, another elephant in the room is the fact that Donovan Short was basically invisible in this game, and did not even start. He was heralded as one of the best recruits to come through GB in some time, and he hardly made an impact. Sure, its one exhibition game, fine, if that is your critique. However, Will's words on the latest podcast were interesting in that it sounded like this is pretty much the rotation they're going to roll with, as well as the fact that he failed to mention Donovan in the section where he detailed guys that will likely make an impact this year.
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Oct 26, 2022 10:23:01 GMT -6
I'd really love to know how you out talent and out athletic ability 4 guys sitting in or near the lane. The entire concept of the SNC defense is to keep superior talent from getting in the paint for easy hoops.
Last year Mitch Listau made the SNC defense look stupid because he made 3's. Unfortunately Listau didn't hit many 3's against an extended defense the rest of the season.
If GB isn't making their 3's and then when they do get in the lane they aren't making their free throws it is going to make SNC look really good. Certain guys took longer than others to get used to SNC reaching in for the ball when they tried to get in the lane.
Short was in the main rotation last night as he was one of the first guys off of the bench. He also came in late in the game for Cade Meyer when the game was very much on the line. He walled up inside several times on defense and had some rebounds.
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Post by doublej on Oct 26, 2022 10:39:27 GMT -6
Some observations and stats from yesterday:
-Brock Heffner is like a untagged puppy with too much energy. He doesn't sit down while out of the game and stretches/paces around at the end of the bench wearing to get back in. It's funny and great to see
-The team has much more of a feel and look of encouragement and energy from the bench as well. More passion and comradery
-The reason this game was close was really due to not making shots and having too many perimeter touches only on offense. Some of the stats will tell that story I think. St Norbert played their butt off and had a good amount of fans in the building since there in town
Stats: 9/16 from 2 point range, 56% 6/27 from 3, 22% 14/26 from the line, 54% 30 total rebounds, 3 offensive 4 staeals 7 blocks 11 turnovers
Scorers: 0 with 11pts 1 with 4 pts 3 with 14pts 4 with 5pts 5 with 3pts 11 with 2pts (from the line) 21 with 4pts 24 with 4pts 55 with 3pts
Some 3's were half way down, FT shooting was more of an issue IMO as we could have stretched the lead multiple times but didn't capitalize. A few more shots go down it's a different game
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Post by thetulsawarrior on Oct 26, 2022 11:16:44 GMT -6
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