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Post by fightphoe93 on Jan 24, 2015 17:58:06 GMT -6
I thought Mays was out due to foul trouble. He picked up 2 fouls the first half pretty early. I think Wardle was trying to make sure Mays was out there on offensive possessions as much as possible at the bitter end of the game. But I really think Wardle was worried about the fouls in Mays' case.
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Post by shooting the J on Jan 24, 2015 18:46:42 GMT -6
^^^ Seriously? Did you even watch the game last night? Lowe literally contributed next to nothing and caused nothing but turnovers and headaches for GB fans. I watched live, and then watched it on DVR again this morning. Lowe hit 3 of 4 shots. 1 of the turnovers he was credited with was a pass to his ankles by Sykes. That's just a bad pass. Lowe forced numerous misses by going straight up without fouling. His passing is key.
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Post by knightlyfe920 on Jan 24, 2015 22:17:23 GMT -6
^^^ Seriously? Did you even watch the game last night? Lowe literally contributed next to nothing and caused nothing but turnovers and headaches for GB fans. I watched live, and then watched it on DVR again this morning. Lowe hit 3 of 4 shots. 1 of the turnovers he was credited with was a pass to his ankles by Sykes. That's just a bad pass. Lowe forced numerous misses by going straight up without fouling. His passing is key. Obviously I'm missing something, maybe you're a family friend or something but whatever. Making excuses for him doesn't solve the fact that he played AWFULLY last night. Yes he was three of four but one was a wide open dunk and two others were lucky turn around Js. His poor play could have cost us the game ultimately.
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Jan 25, 2015 8:11:10 GMT -6
I thought Mays was out due to foul trouble. He picked up 2 fouls the first half pretty early. I think Wardle was trying to make sure Mays was out there on offensive possessions as much as possible at the bitter end of the game. But I really think Wardle was worried about the fouls in Mays' case. I agree. Mays had two fouls in the first half, he got them fairly early. The second came just after the 14 minute mark. With two fouls coach Wardle brought him back in during the first half and he played the last few minutes including a dunk and a free throw. In the second half he had his 4th foul by the 8 minute mark. Wardle saved Mays for the end and he delivered with a big runner. I can't say that Wardle totally misplayed that. Lowe came in early for McKinnie because McKinnie had two defensive breakdowns. I know that some fans don't like the quick hook but Wardle is consistent with you have to play defense if you want to play. As for the rest of the game it was entertaining. GB came up big when they needed to, out of timeouts in particular. They didn't get rattled being down 10 points or starting slowly. They played good defense without fouling despite having two deflating missed 1 and 1's that could have iced the game. I think a more experienced team was able to make the plays that were needed to get a win (excluding free throw shooting).
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Post by markus31x on Jan 25, 2015 9:36:53 GMT -6
I'm glad Wardle is our coach and not knightlyfe920.
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Post by knightlyfe920 on Jan 25, 2015 10:21:58 GMT -6
I'm glad Wardle is our coach and not knightlyfe920. This forum should be renamed the Wardle and Lowe fan club. I think we should just crown Lowe defensive player of the year already without playing the rest of the games and give Wardle NCAA coach of the year according to this site. Any intelligent critique against them is met with what is equivalent to a three year old's temper tantrum or people coming out of the woodwork with comments that don't pertain in any way to basketball or even resemble a coherent thought.
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Post by markus31x on Jan 25, 2015 12:34:30 GMT -6
I suppose I pretty much just trolled you, but GBPhoenix1 and ShootingJ both disproved your ramblings about Lowe and Mays.
You clearly have something against Wardle and Lowe.
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Post by jonnyindepere on Jan 25, 2015 12:51:53 GMT -6
Knightlyfe920, your posts are becoming very annoying. There is no problem with constructive criticism of the coach or any of the players. However, we get your point, you don't like BW and you don't like Lowe. Winning isn't always going to be pretty, the guys aren't going to play perfect games. Against a team like Valpo you need contributions from everyone and for a lot of guys to get minutes, the fact of the matter is Lowe hit 3 of 4 shots, lucky or not I like that from a guy off of the bench. Our front court depth isn't very strong coming off the bench, which is why we're now seeing Kanter getting minutes. BW is working with what he has, Mays can't go all 40 every night. The team did enough to get a win against a very good team, great win Phoenix, can't wait for CSU.
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Post by knightlyfe920 on Jan 25, 2015 22:11:59 GMT -6
What is annoying is how everyone tries to justify every move Wardle makes and say he is an amazing coach for doing so. Wardle could say the sky was red and you people would back him up. Lowe could make a backwards half court shot and people on here would commend his three point shooting and praise Wardle for coaching him up to do so. Just watch, Wardle WILL end up costing us critical games or the season. You say Wardle is working with what he's got, but honestly the players are just working with what they've got in a coach. Mays will miss one jump shot and you guys clamor for his benching in favor of Lowe, yet he makes ten times more mistakes. Then, when Mays comes back in and hits a jumper everyone claims Wardle is "a genius" (someone actually said this about this very situation on here) for pulling Mays and motivating him. Seriously, take the blinders off and open your eyes, maybe you'd recognize that Wardle doesn't have much coaching skill. I really don't care who does or doesn't like what I have to say but if you totally reject it you are simply in denial.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2015 2:50:01 GMT -6
I agree with flye,
I am glad your holding your position and still responding and you haven't been run off from this site yet. Anyone who does have a strong opinion against BW usually gets attacked so strongly that they leave because it isn't worth trying to convince a bunch of cool aide drinking followers.
If Wardle was such a great coach he wouldn't be in Green Bay still!
You have not bashed him in every comment you make and you have given credit to those who deserve it .
BW happened to get very lucky with Kiefer and Brown. It will be very interesting to see what happens after Kiefer leaves. Flye, I can tell, you have played some basketball and understand the game. I really like your analysis and your points have made others who read this site think about what really could have been done with the talent on this team with a different coach imvolved.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2015 2:53:20 GMT -6
Sorry not Flye, Knightlyfe..... My bad
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Post by shooting the J on Jan 26, 2015 7:03:04 GMT -6
What is annoying is how everyone tries to justify every move Wardle makes and say he is an amazing coach for doing so. Wardle could say the sky was red and you people would back him up. Lowe could make a backwards half court shot and people on here would commend his three point shooting and praise Wardle for coaching him up to do so. Just watch, Wardle WILL end up costing us critical games or the season. You say Wardle is working with what he's got, but honestly the players are just working with what they've got in a coach. Mays will miss one jump shot and you guys clamor for his benching in favor of Lowe, yet he makes ten times more mistakes. Then, when Mays comes back in and hits a jumper everyone claims Wardle is "a genius" (someone actually said this about this very situation on here) for pulling Mays and motivating him. Seriously, take the blinders off and open your eyes, maybe you'd recognize that Wardle doesn't have much coaching skill. I really don't care who does or doesn't like what I have to say but if you totally reject it you are simply in denial. Mays was never benched for missing a shot. He wasn't playing defense, and the benching worked. You seem bitter about that. The team keeps winning big games. You seem bitter about that too. The reason we think Wardle is a good coach is simply because we understand the game.
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Jan 26, 2015 7:05:40 GMT -6
For Bigv and Knightlfye, you guys both would have played Mays more in the first half when he had 2 fouls with 14 minutes to go and you would have left Mays in with GB up 2 when he had 4 fouls with 8 minutes to go? I don't think there is a good coach in the country that would risk their second best player getting a third or fifth foul then. Now if you want to debate who subs in because you don't like Lowe that is a separate issue that could be open for discussion but the original statement was don't play Lowe over Mays. Mays should have been out in those situations end of story.
As for the future. People act like Sykes and Brown were sure fire NBA guys that Wardle recruited. They weren't even close to that, obviously Wardle did at least something to contribute to their growth. Plus it is hard to ignore how much better McKinnie, Mays, Love and Fouse are compared to when they arrived. I would guess GB stays near the top of the league as there seems to be a steady list of guys improving.
As a side note to my comment about McKinnie having two defensive breakdowns early. I sit in seats that are close enough to see and hear the bench clearly. Wardle was on McKinnie verbally once after a Valpo score and yanked him after a second. So while I wasn't watching what he did I watched the response from the bench and put 2 and 2 together.
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Post by phoenixphan87 on Jan 26, 2015 13:08:30 GMT -6
Lowe is an average at best mid major power forward. Limited offensively and tries to do too much when he gets the ball in the post. That being said, he provides us with a wider body big man, plays solid low post defense, and deserves the rotation minutes that he is getting. We have had Fouse and Mays get into first half foul trouble which makes Lowe a must play option off the bench. I dont see anyone else able to do what he does(Uwaidae hasnt developed) I think the ceiling for a guy like Kenny will be about 8-10pts/5-6rbs a game as a senior. Hopefully by then he will be more sure of himself with the ball in the post and limits the turnovers.
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Post by knightlyfe920 on Jan 26, 2015 14:03:59 GMT -6
What is annoying is how everyone tries to justify every move Wardle makes and say he is an amazing coach for doing so. Wardle could say the sky was red and you people would back him up. Lowe could make a backwards half court shot and people on here would commend his three point shooting and praise Wardle for coaching him up to do so. Just watch, Wardle WILL end up costing us critical games or the season. You say Wardle is working with what he's got, but honestly the players are just working with what they've got in a coach. Mays will miss one jump shot and you guys clamor for his benching in favor of Lowe, yet he makes ten times more mistakes. Then, when Mays comes back in and hits a jumper everyone claims Wardle is "a genius" (someone actually said this about this very situation on here) for pulling Mays and motivating him. Seriously, take the blinders off and open your eyes, maybe you'd recognize that Wardle doesn't have much coaching skill. I really don't care who does or doesn't like what I have to say but if you totally reject it you are simply in denial. Mays was never benched for missing a shot. He wasn't playing defense, and the benching worked. You seem bitter about that. The team keeps winning big games. You seem bitter about that too. The reason we think Wardle is a good coach is simply because we understand the game. I don't think you all realize the other options that Wardle has off the bench. While not as quite as big, Humphrey has a similar body type and no doubt a greater skill set, half the time Lowe is defending at the top of the key anyway so I don't think it would be that radical to suggest that we could give up some size there in favor of more skill. Kanter should be the go-to big guy off the bench and has played well in his limited minutes. His offense is terrific in the post and he has not proved to be a liability on defense either. Uwadiae has not developed as of yet but his length on defense would be a boost. Lowe cannot block shots or rebound nearly as well as Uwadiae, however both are very uncoordinated. Believe it or not, other big guys can pass from the top of the key (although I really would rather just keep my big guys in the post) and wait for it....they can also put their hands up on defense too! Lowe should not be lauded because he "puts his hands up" and can pass at a college level. The deficiencies in his game should give Wardle every reason to keep him on the bench. Honestly, the reason I think Lowe gets playing time is because he just does whatever hot head Wardle tells him to and acts as his "pet", if you will. Why do you think Garrett got benched for the second half of last year? Not because of his play, but because he lacked a submissive attitude towards Wardle. The same goes for Mays this year it seems. I'm sure when Wardle gets heated in practice whomever doesn't cower in fear and obey is automatically put on his bad side. When someone doesn't follow his questionable gameplan, he throws a fit and benches them regardless of their overall performance. The argument that Wardle has to be a hardass as a coach is invalid. I too have coached and I can speak from experience that making players bow down to you doesn't work, there should be a mutual respect going both ways. Mays was in a little foul trouble in this one but that did not justify his frequent benching during the last 5 or so minutes of the game. Wardle plays timid in tight games and plays "not to lose" much like another Green Bay head coach we all know. Obviously you don't "simply understand the game" because anyone that has ever been exposed to basketball could tell in an instant who should be playing and who shouldn't, as well as the fact that Wardle himself does not win the team games.
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