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Post by gbbrl97 on May 9, 2013 21:15:10 GMT -6
I think that may still open the door for Northern Kentucky.......I can see IUPUI eventually in the HL, if they decide to go to 12 teams and 2 divisions.
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Post by stillaphoenixphan on May 9, 2013 21:44:50 GMT -6
I think that may still open the door for Northern Kentucky.......I can see IUPUI eventually in the HL, if they decide to go to 12 teams and 2 divisions. I too like NKU as a travel partner for WSU. I also think if IUPUI commited to sports like Baseball they would have a lot better chance to get into the HL. I love the 12 team with 2 divisions. Playoff ideas are endless. Also gives HL teams more D1 games.
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Post by PantherU on May 10, 2013 14:18:43 GMT -6
Marketing is everything in this day and age and those letters (IUPUI) just don't cut it. They should lose the letters and, since both branches are in Indy, just call themselves Indianapolis. Sounds better than "Ooey-Pooey"! THEN we can talk! Agreed, but isn't there already a private school there of that name? They'd have to be Indy State or something similar. I can think of one school that might not enjoy them being "Indy State."
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Post by Chuck A on May 10, 2013 15:18:01 GMT -6
Yeah, you're right Blackpanther, there is already an Indianapolis. Oh well, that does it for IUPUI.
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Post by gbbrl97 on May 10, 2013 19:02:10 GMT -6
IUPUI could take a page out of a school like Wayne State (in Detroit, MI), and name the university based on the country they are located in.....In this case, it would be Marion State......Better than confusing the casual college basketball fan with an Indiana University, Indiana State University, University of Indianapolis, and an Indianapolis State......
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Mar 9, 2014 16:31:06 GMT -6
Did anyone else watch the LeCrone press conference this weekend?
After a lot of babble about stuff that nobody cares about he finally talked about growing the league, both in terms of what to do with existing members and what to do about adding members.
He did come out and say they want to be known as a men's basketball league. He did say they want to financially reward the teams that do the best. Both based on wins, tournament success and RPI among other factors. There wasn't anything in particular outlined. However, it was good to hear. Teams like YSU need to get their stuff together because they won't be getting paid as much if they don't.
When it comes to membership he was coy. It sounds like they are open to expansion but nothing is on the front burner. I think the financial incentive is good for expansion. I look at Belmont as a good example. They lost in the OVC finals to E. Kentucky. If they were in the HL I think their numbers would look that much better for an at large selection. Plus they are consistently good so they would be getting a bigger share of league money. That might look tempting for them right about now.
Also on membership he indicated that they have several scenarios drawn up offensively and defensively. They have good intelligence as to what is happening around the HL and with other leagues. I get the impression that NKU is lock but because we don't need them yet they haven't been added. Who else would be out there that would want in without hesitation in the event another HL member left?
I wrote this on another board but my dream scenario would be YSU leaves to go to the OVC. Their facilities, budget and football are a better fit there. Then adding Belmont, Evansville, Duquesne and NKU to go to 12 teams. This results in 7 public schools, 5 private schools, all in medium to large cities, similar budgets and in a geographic foot print that makes sense. I know this is easier said than done but I like to aim higher and this is what I would aim for. I think these schools together would grow the competitiveness of the men's basketball brand and help guide the HL to a higher RPI and better chance of getting multiple bids year over year.
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Post by gbbrl97 on Mar 9, 2014 18:17:11 GMT -6
I would love it if YSU left.....Since they are the only HL school with scholarship football (Valpo has football, but it is a non-scholarship program), they would fit better with an existing D1-FCS conference.
I can see us adding NKU if YSU left, but why would Belmont, Evansville, or Duquesne leave their respective conferences? I know at one point Robert Morris was also thrown out there as well. I don't see Evansville leaving the MVC or Duquesne leaving the A10 for the HL, although those teams have finished in the bottom third of their conferences for a good decade now. Having that association with the MVC or A10 must mean a lot to them although they are both struggling programs.
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Post by PantherU on Mar 9, 2014 19:57:39 GMT -6
We all want YSU gone. Lecrone caved when he couldn't get Oakland or Valpo the first time around
Sent from my SCH-R970 using proboards
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Mar 10, 2014 6:53:25 GMT -6
I would love it if YSU left.....Since they are the only HL school with scholarship football (Valpo has football, but it is a non-scholarship program), they would fit better with an existing D1-FCS conference. I can see us adding NKU if YSU left, but why would Belmont, Evansville, or Duquesne leave their respective conferences? I know at one point Robert Morris was also thrown out there as well. I don't see Evansville leaving the MVC or Duquesne leaving the A10 for the HL, although those teams have finished in the bottom third of their conferences for a good decade now. Having that association with the MVC or A10 must mean a lot to them although they are both struggling programs. The premise for Evansville and Duquesne is simple. With what they spend and the support for their current program it is going to be a long time if ever before they can compete in their current leagues. They spend amounts that are very competitive for the HL. This year Evansville beat Loyola twice and Valpo once. They drew good home crowds for Wichita St, Butler and one other team but the rest of the time they had about 4000 people. Now that is pretty good but I would guess if they were playing for a league title they could draw huge crowds. Look at what winning did for GB. They had 4 HL crowds of 5000+ (Detroit, WSU, Milwaukee x2) which for GB is pretty big and hasn't been happening for 5 years. Duquesne averaged 2900 people and didn't draw big crowds for anyone including St. Louis. I think they have to rebuild their base but again if they were winning maybe people fill up their gym. Once that happens money flows in to the school and people want to be part of the experience. Belmont doesn't need the HL for winning but it would sure help them in a year like this. The 24th ranked conference, the OVC, more than likely isn't getting an at large bid. However, if they had their same body of work coming from a much stronger conference maybe they move to a more solid position on the bubble. I am not saying it will be easy. I am saying these are programs that as a whole can lift the HL. In time I would expect the 12 team league of schools I mentioned to be a top ten rated league. If that happens then those schools no longer have to feel like they are missing out on their current affiliation with the A10 of MVC.
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Post by gbbrl97 on Mar 10, 2014 8:02:01 GMT -6
If Evansville did leave the MVC, that would start another chain reaction in mid-major conference shuffling......Who would the MVC want to replace Evansville with? They could cannablize the Summit League with Western Illinois, since they already play in the MVC for football. They could also expand into NDSU and/or SDSU since both of nthose teams also play in the MVC for football as well. A program like NDSU in the MVC may be an upgrade over Evansville....However, I would be afraid the MVC could hit the HL again for a new member if Evansville did leave.
Since the A10 is so large already and since Davidson will be joining them next year (making it 14 in the A10), losing 1-3 teams may actually improve the product, especially as the Big East may take St. Louis, and Dayton/Richmond eventually.
I would love Belmont in the HL, but will they love the travel to the Upper Midwest for most of their games, as Wright State (and maybe NKU) would be the closest team (or teams)?
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Mar 10, 2014 17:51:05 GMT -6
I was the one that brought up Lipscomb on the HL message board. One question that I don't know the answer to is how does Belmont look at them? I know they play in different conferences now but they do play a h/h series in hoops. However, does Belmont look at them like Detroit looks at Oakland? Would going after Lipscomb help or hurt in trying to land Belmont?
Obviously Murray State is a fantastic geographic and hoops fit for a southern expansion. For whatever reason in my own mind they seem unlikely to join. However if they are an option then they are a must get. Even if football grows them out of the league eventually I see no way the HL and its fans regret the time they are in the league.
I know Duquesne isn't on the HL radar and the HL isn't on their radar. I just think they should be. Would you rather drive 72 miles to YSU or 132 miles to Duquesne as a travel partner for CSU? Ask yourself who has a better chance to succeed in the signature sport for the league, men's hoops, DU or YSU? I don't think DU can compete in the A10 but with a financial incentive system in place and adding some combination of Evansville, Murray State, Belmont and NKU the HL suddenly should look better in for both parties.
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Post by can opener man on Mar 11, 2014 19:26:38 GMT -6
Instead of reaching for a team i would wait til a northern Kentucky Chicago state, or ipfw develop into a horizon league caliber program. Make them invest, recruit and build to that level. I'm content at nine, when someone hits that level send the invite
Wow summit league attendence for title game is 23 k. Did I just see that right for this game....wow
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Post by gbbrl97 on Mar 12, 2014 6:30:39 GMT -6
I looked at the box score on ESPN and it listed the attendance at 4,263. It might have been 23K for the entire tournament.
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Mar 12, 2014 7:33:12 GMT -6
Instead of reaching for a team i would wait til a northern Kentucky Chicago state, or ipfw develop into a horizon league caliber program. Make them invest, recruit and build to that level. I'm content at nine, when someone hits that level send the invite In the case of Chicago State and IPFW I think we are going to be waiting for a while. I personally like IPFW the most from the Summit League in terms of how they could fit if they elevated their overall program. They are in an HL type market in terms of it's size, it is a good geographic fit, they have access to a real arena for hoops and they have a cool nickname. Yet I don't see them getting the kind of money together that they need to be successful year over year. I personally have no interest in Chicago State and never will. I have been to their campus and they have some nice stuff but it is a true commuter school. That is pretty hard to excel in sports with.
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Post by GBPhoenix1 on Mar 12, 2014 7:39:11 GMT -6
I know Duquesne isn't on the HL radar and the HL isn't on their radar. I just think they should be. Would you rather drive 72 miles to YSU or 132 miles to Duquesne as a travel partner for CSU? Ask yourself who has a better chance to succeed in the signature sport for the league, men's hoops, DU or YSU? I don't think DU can compete in the A10 but with a financial incentive system in place and adding some combination of Evansville, Murray State, Belmont and NKU the HL suddenly should look better in for both parties. Obviously Duquesne is a better option than YSU, but YSU isn't going anywhere so it's a moot point. They don't want to leave and the HL doesn't have any bylaws in place that would allow us to kick them out. Even if we wanted to still add Duquesne, we would also have to add another PA team to be a travel partner for them since we cannot get rid of YSU. I don't think there is a good option to add with them and if we did go that route there is no chance to add Belmont. They have no desire to join the HL as the only southern team. They could have joined the MVC last year and passed due to travel concerns. I don't think Belmont would have a problem with Lipscomb as long as the rest of the teams we add are quality teams and southern based. They don't care about our private vs. public ratio. They are concerned about our conference's stability (since we recently lost 2 members and had 4 others that pursued joining the MVC), our conferences potential to help them get at large bids, and travel costs. We cannot do anything about our stability besides making sure we don't lose any members in the near future. I think our ability to be ranked 13 and 14th the last 2 years shows that we are a solid enough conference to help their at large potential. I think if Green Bay would have been able to pick up a few more wins this year and been able to get an at large bid it would have been a huge selling point. I really think we need to add at least 2 other southern schools to get them to join the conference. Another positive is that they do not like the OVC's emphasis on football. They like that the HL wants to be known as a basketball conference. It shouldn't be about bylaws with YSU. It should be about showing them the new financial incentives and then letting them draw their own conclusions. With the facilities they have, the focus on football and a general lack capital for hoops they are only going to fall further behind. They need to figure out how to change their program and get to the HL standard which then I am fine with them or they need to move on. LeCrone likes to talk in his academic way and I would guess the university heads like this. However, he needs to talk in a business way because this is a business and his job is to grow it. In the business world YSU would be encouraged/required to act in a much different way. For goodness sake they didn't fire Slocum after this year. I know it is a tough sale for a new coach but what are they protecting? They should try and aim higher with a new voice. I could at least respect a failure in that case.
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